Nation Design Ideas: A conflicting POV

Recently I got around to checking on this new [Middle-earth PBM 4th Age] 1000 scenario I've heard so much about. I went "Surfing" to the web to GSI's web site. I downloaded the Nation Design sheets, abridged rules, and both strategy articles. I started with the Nation Design Ideas, and found it totally useless. I simply didn't understand the rules well enough to understand the concepts of Erving's article. I went to the Nation Design sheets next. These were very well designed. I applaud GSI for the format. I read and re-read these sheets. I analyzed these forms every way I could think of. I then read and re-read the rules. I wish the entire rules were on the web, but you take what you can get

[ed. note: all of the rules except for the order's section is included in the copy at the WWW site].

I studied the maps, identifying sites for population center placement. Next came the article on this. Some really great ideas here.

After studying everything I could find, I made lists of questions and sent them to friends already in some of these games. Questions begot more questions. Finally it was time to get down to business. I designed a North Kingdom, South Kingdom, and many nations of each alliance. I even designed nations for teams.

Finally I got back to the Article on Nation Design. While Erving admits that he was taking inspiration from earlier scenarios, I see this as a major error.

[ed. note: clearly, as stated by both Erving and the rulebook - pages 8-9].

I see, what I consider, major flaws in almost all of his designs.

The whole point of being non-human is to get the starting 60 agents at 50 cost. Where are the agent SNAs. Why start with war machines? They are to easy to lose in the small armies present at the start of the game.

To only select "Spell" SNAs seems ridicules to me. Teleport? Your obviously building a military nation, why have a character nation spell. Conjure Hordes? Your not going to get so far from home that you need this spell. The troops are poorer then poor, and still cost as much as normal Men-at-arms (which are the worst troop in the game). Summon Storms? How much does tactics really effect battle?

The 30A, 30M was to have Teleport, Divine allegiance forces, and Divine characters with forces. I'm not sure what the mission of the character would be. If he'll be traveling with the army, why no combat spells. Where is he going that he needs Teleport? Basically, I see that this nation has wasted all of its SNAs. SNAs are the most powerful factor in this game, and should not be used unwisely.

[Erving: Are agents really the whole point of being non-human/Evil? Any nation/race that focuses only on being oriented toward their best skill becomes rather predictable, no? War machines make an excellent addition, especially to small armies - in fact, they can help keep that small army from being destroyed, are good for threats, etc.]

Who is going to rely on a 50 ScoChar? Not me! If you are going to be a military nation, you're going to have many commanders. The ability to have agents and emissaries recon is nice, but not all that great. New HI start at training 30 is poor because training counts for so little in the combat algorithm. New armies start with moral 40 should only be selected if hire armies free is also selected. Since he has both of these, I'll cut him some slack. I still think better SNAs can be selected. With 2 60 commanders and 2 artifacts chances are very good of retrieving lost artifacts, if they had a decent mage to locate them.

Again, training is poor. 1/3 TI ships, but not warship strength 5? I'd rather have fewer ships (since they have the same gold costs) than saving the TI. Stealth on a nation with a navy and mages? What for?

[Erving: Not every nation should be designed toward augmenting a single strength. There are excellent reasons to compliment your nation with characteristics that will minimize your weaknesses, while at the same time making your nation strong.]

I actually like this design. Think of putting camps on non-plains along the coast, so that enemy ships can't land. If you get around to upgrading, you can add the harbor to make it a recruiting center.

What the heck is the 60 going to be doing that a 50 couldn't do, for 500 less. Well maybe hunt artifacts. Why does he have emissary skill? Is he going to be a capital commander, an army commander, or an artifact hunter? Any way I see it, the emissary skill is a waste. Use 400 to get the 40E up to 60. Camps will be easier to place, and the higher loyalty will make them easier to improve. To be a military power, you'll need income.

Why the heck choose a human for an agent nation. You don't need the income a military nation does, so the 60E is not as important as 2 60 Agents. If your going evil anyway, select non-human.

I thought a long time about the Name 40 agents vs. better chance of Stealth. As Woodmen in 2950, I didn't get stealth on my first 6 agents. A commander got stealth and an emissary. got a challenge bonus. Big deal. Selecting 40 agents allows the character to move to a friendly pop center and steal gold from it's first turn. This increases time to usability by several turns. Of course, my first agent with stealth got 34, making him a net 64 agent on turn 1.

If you're an emissary nation, why do you need a SNA that allows all characters uncover secrets at 40? Uncover secrets is one of those last ditch orders. You select it when you just can't think of anything better to have the emissary. Do with their second order.

[Erving: Uncover Secrets could just be the big surprise bonus in 4th Age 1000! After all, how else will you find out what the other nation's SNAs are? And this kind of knowledge could be extremely critical.]

Weakness should only be learned on the way to sickness or curse. As a stand alone spell, it is poor. The best mage for this nation is a 30. Assuming prenticing every turn, it should be a 60 by turn 12. This would allow him to cast the spell for 20 points of damage each turn. That means that he could single-handedly kill any character in the game in only 15 turns, assuming you can get them to sit still that long. Of course my point is that any artifact that allows access to curse also allows access to weakness. Save the SNA for something better.

BTW: What is an emissary nation going to do with 3 artifacts? The best commander is a 40, the best mage and agent are only 30.

[Erving: What would any nation do with 3 artifacts - grin!]

Three 60 mages and 3 artifacts. Definitely a good artifact hunting nation. Why stealth? I already talked about the uselessness of training. Now this is a nation that weakness almost makes sense for. Nah, go get a curse artifact.

Not bad. I can't find any obvious things I disagree with. Perhaps a better mage would be nice.

Nation 10: Good Dwarven, SNAs: All characters scout/recon at 50, challenge rank bonus, 1/2 TI fortifications, Hidden capital, 2 towers, camp 60C; 50E; 50A; 50M; 40C; 40E; 30A; 30M

No way I would hide my capital. The kingdoms get an area map on each nations capital, so they'll know where it is and could easily reveal it. Any nation that had a map covering your area would surely notice a MT was not visible. It wouldn't take long to figure out where it is. If I ever take a hidden pop. center it will be a new camp I added. This way no one could notice a missing pop. center. Use your 50E and it's starting 50 loyalty to improve it to a TN or MT. This option is probably better for a non-military nation since any recruiting done at a hidden population center is like a flare letting everyone know it is there.

[ed. note: This is not, in fact, completely correct. The Kingdoms do get an area map (at the game beginning only) that is only 'roughly' centered on the capital (may be off by a hex in any direction). Thus, the Kingdoms may not know exactly where the capital is, nor whose it is! And a hidden capital, accompanied by a second MT truly does look like a normal nation. Besides, even if a nation could determine that a hidden capital exists, there are a lot of hexes to search in the possible location radius. Furthermore, the 434 spell will not be common at game start (it is a Hard spell). This further ensures the safety of hidden capitals and PCs.]

My philosophy: Your not alone in the world, so don't assume you will be. Even if you join a non-team game, there will be 7, 8, 9, or even 11 other nations of your allegiance. I would build a nation that was very good at one thing rather than try to build a nation good at several things. Here are my steps for designing a nation.

• Choose an alliance.
• Decide what type of character I want to specialize in.
• Select the race (if alliance matches) that gets a discount on 60 characters of that class.
• Choose SNAs that enhance this strength: (most important). Make sure they will be used frequently and effectively. Once you choose these, they can't be taken away. Once the game starts, you can't get any you passed on. Hidden pop. centers can be revealed. Artifacts can be lost and found (verbs, not adjectives or a noun). Ships and war machines can be built or destroyed. The ability to scout at double rank, buy and sell at 20 % adjustment, or get a +20 to assassinate/kidnap orders can't be lost or gained. Don't choose SNAs just because they are only selectable by your race. Troops start at 25 training rank is poor, so don't select it. Especially if you're selecting Elven because you want to specialize in Mage or Naval power.
• Select sites for population centers.
• Make pop center modifications to match gold needs and location demands.
• Characters: (second most important). I'd take two 60s of whatever class you get a discount on. Make the most of this opportunity. If I decided to play an agent nation, I'd get stealth on at least one of my 60 agents. For a non-agent, non-non-human, nation, I'd take two 40 agents rather than a 50 or 60. There will be very few agents that can defeat a 40 guard at the start of the game. Since mages train so slowly, don't cut corners here. Do your best to scrape up the cash to get a 50. Unless Dwarven, only get a 60 commander to use as an artifact hunter. You had better have a good mage to do the locates. Better to have several good characters than one great one.

  This is just my opinion, but I welcome feedback.

  [ed. note: Yes, an excellent idea! The above article offers some good 'food for thought'. What to the rest of you 4th Age experts think? Do you agree, or disagree, or do you have an article that you wish to submit?]

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